School me on ORI Struts......

[abendx]

Really a question for Richard, but anyone with good info, please contribute.

I am thinking that a set of these might be what I want.... the Jeep is not a DD, but does see some action on the street, moving between trails and sometimes the girl just likes a nice ride up the coast with the top off. My wheeling is almost pure crawling, so no worries of anything at speed.

Are these a good or bad idea and why? What size (diameter) would I be looking at and how does one go about determining the length? Are my mounting options basically the same I'd have with a C/O, but without the need for bump cans, shocks, and sway bars?

I do have an interesting issue though.... my heep will be changing over the next year. I will likely truggy the rear and do something a little different to the front (currently I am thinking to run bars from the bumper to the nerb bars and removing the fenders all together). So I'll likely have a lot more room to play with once that stuff is done. Is it even possible to work with that 'issue' without having to rebuy the struts (longer or ???) at a later date?

Also Richard.... can you PM me a ballpark price on these. I know there is a big sale going on right now... so that is part of the reason I am maybe jumping ahead of myself.

[Crazy Sammy]

WELL I CAN TELL YOU I HAVE THEM ON MY RIG AND I WILL NEVER HAVE ANYTHING ELSE JUST BECAUSE OF THE STABILITY THAT YOU GET IT JUST MAKES YOU FEEL BETTER IN THE SEAT WHILE PLAYING! ON MY RIG WHEN I PUT THEM ON I LOST FROM ABOUT 60'' OF FLEX DOWN TO ABOUT 50'' ROUGHLY BUT WITH THE STABILITY IT IS AMAZING THAT I CAN GO WAY MORE PLACES NOW THAN BEFORE BECAUSE BEFORE MY SUSPENSION WOULD UNLOAD AND FLOP IT OVER BUT NOW IT JUST CRAWLS AND FEELS GERY STABLE. I DONT KNOW ALOT OR HARDLY ANYTHING ABOUT THEM EXCEPT THAT I HAVE THEM LOVE THEM AND WILL HAVE THEM ON MY NEXT RIG ASWELL! WHEN MOUNTING THEM UNLIKE THE KING COIL OVERS( NOT KNOCKING THEM AT ALL) YOU DONT HAVE TO BUY BUMP STOPS OR STRAPS OR SHOCKS SO ON MY RIG IM PRESSED FOR ROOM IT REALLY HELPED ME SO I DIDNT HAVE TO PUT ALL THAT UNDER THERE. BUT THERE ARE ALOT OF PARTS IN THEM SO WHEN OR IF THEY EVER BREAK IM SURE IT WILL GET PRICY BUT REALLY WHAT DOESNT! OH AND THEY ARE EASY TO ADJUST! NOT FOR ME BUT RICHARD THEY ARE BECAUSE HE KNOWS WHAT HE IS DOING I MEAN THAT YOU CAN DO IT ON THE RIG WITH NITROGEN AND A REG. JUST MY THOUGHTS IF YOU EVER COME AND WHEEL WITH USE YOU CAN RIDE WITH ME AND SEE THEM WORK FOR YOUR SELF! I PUT MINE ON THE RODE AS WELL AND THEY DO GOOD BUT I SHOULD PUT A SWAY BAR ON IF IT IS A DAILY DRIVER!

[abendx]

Thanks Josh.

Do you think the weigh of my rig would be too much for these? I'm guessing I am pretty fat... Maybe around 5.5k as a guess.

[Crazy Sammy]

from what i have read about and also seen the rigs that they are on i think you would be fine with them. the only thing that i see with the weight issue is that if you are running high speed in the desert over whoops and things like that they might heat up and start to fade a little but our rigs really arent built for that but they do have a upgrade that you cand buy and make them like a resivour for more heat distribution but richard should tell you more on that im new to them but i love the way my rig handles and crawls it makes me look like a better driver sometimes! i dont want to steer you in the wrong direction but i read up on them alot before i had to sell both of my legs and one arm to buy them but they are worth every penny to me! the thing i like with them is that when you get it up on a steep angle that they dont unload! except when im on back door but that really helps out and the c/o setup you can watch some of the videos and you can see that when your rig is up at steep angles they tend to push you off from your ride height. once again just saying what i see in them but richard could probably explain it better. since i have had mine on my sammy i know of three people off hand that have switched over to them just by watching me flop mine all the time before with the old suspension and now they see it go and they bought there own. hope this all helps im not even making commission off these so no bs!

[Goatman]

[quote="abendx"]Really a question for Richard, but anyone with good info, please contribute.

I am thinking that a set of these might be what I want.... the Jeep is not a DD, but does see some action on the street, moving between trails and sometimes the girl just likes a nice ride up the coast with the top off. My wheeling is almost pure crawling, so no worries of anything at speed.

Are these a good or bad idea and why? What size (diameter) would I be looking at and how does one go about determining the length? Are my mounting options basically the same I'd have with a C/O, but without the need for bump cans, shocks, and sway bars?

I do have an interesting issue though.... my heep will be changing over the next year. I will likely truggy the rear and do something a little different to the front (currently I am thinking to run bars from the bumper to the nerb bars and removing the fenders all together). So I'll likely have a lot more room to play with once that stuff is done. Is it even possible to work with that 'issue' without having to rebuy the struts (longer or ???) at a later date?

Also Richard.... can you PM me a ballpark price on these. I know there is a big sale going on right now... so that is part of the reason I am maybe jumping ahead of myself.[/quote]


The ORI's will mount basically the same as coilovers, the only difference is that the mounting width is a little wider. Like Josh said, you don't need bump stops or limit straps, or a sway bar. The ORI's will handle up to 1200-1300 lbs per corner, I don't think your Jeep can be that heavy. Axle and tire weight don't count. The only issue you'll deal with regarding shock length if you make changes are the mounting positions. Really, from what you have now to what you might end up with the shock length shouldn't change. I'm not much of a proponent for real long shocks. Too much articulation reduces stability and decreases trail performance.

What length are you thinking?

[Desert Dog]

Now that I am seeing more of them on the trail, I admit that I like what I see mostly.

Except for one thing: A guy was running them on his heavy 4-door at KOH 2 years ago and had one go out (I think the valve failed or something like that, hard to tell with so many complicated small parts in the struts). Anyway, he was totally stranded and up shit creek, but luckily an ORI affiliate had a booth at hammer town and he was able to take the strut there and get fixed up. But moral of the story is that if the strut goes out, you are out of commission. If the shock on your coilovers go out, you can still drive out.

So, IMO, you have to weigh the better trail stability against the remote chance of being stranded if one breaks. I suppose you could keep a trail spare in the tow rig just in case.

Having said that, I am seriously considering running ORIs in the front of my Jeep for the better off-camber stability and so my jeep wont unload while going up ledges in places Moab. The chances of damaging a front strut in the rocks are very remote IMO.

My coilovers were a bitch to tune and get right, changed spring rates and pressures several times. The guys running ORIs seem to be tuning there struts to perfection in one day. Since I already have a nitrogen kit, the ORIs would be easy for me. And how cool would it be to get rid of the sway bar!!!

[abendx]

[quote="Goatman"][quote="abendx"]Really a question for Richard, but anyone with good info, please contribute.

I am thinking that a set of these might be what I want.... the Jeep is not a DD, but does see some action on the street, moving between trails and sometimes the girl just likes a nice ride up the coast with the top off. My wheeling is almost pure crawling, so no worries of anything at speed.

Are these a good or bad idea and why? What size (diameter) would I be looking at and how does one go about determining the length? Are my mounting options basically the same I'd have with a C/O, but without the need for bump cans, shocks, and sway bars?

I do have an interesting issue though.... my heep will be changing over the next year. I will likely truggy the rear and do something a little different to the front (currently I am thinking to run bars from the bumper to the nerb bars and removing the fenders all together). So I'll likely have a lot more room to play with once that stuff is done. Is it even possible to work with that 'issue' without having to rebuy the struts (longer or ???) at a later date?

Also Richard.... can you PM me a ballpark price on these. I know there is a big sale going on right now... so that is part of the reason I am maybe jumping ahead of myself.[/quote]


The ORI's will mount basically the same as coilovers, the only difference is that the mounting width is a little wider. Like Josh said, you don't need bump stops or limit straps, or a sway bar. The ORI's will handle up to 1200-1300 lbs per corner, I don't think your Jeep can be that heavy. Axle and tire weight don't count. The only issue you'll deal with regarding shock length if you make changes are the mounting positions. Really, from what you have now to what you might end up with the shock length shouldn't change. I'm not much of a proponent for real long shocks. Too much articulation reduces stability and decreases trail performance.

What length are you thinking?[/quote]

Thanks Richard.... see that's the thing, I have no clue. :-( I was hoping to get something on sale while it was happening if I could muster up the funds. I guess way more thought needs to go into this.

[Desert Dog]

I also think Richard may be underestimating the weight of our JKs. The ORIs are rated for 1300# per corner sprung weight - thats 5200# total. When you remove the tire and axle weight from the equation, our 6k# JKs are pretty close to the max. What the JK guys have found is that they had to put so much pressure in the ORIs to handle the weight, that the ride was horrible (very stiff) and some were contemplating going back to coilovers. One guy is now using the new ORI remote reservoir attachments, and that seems to be a game changer and soften the ride back out. This is why I am considering ORIs again.

So if you order ORIs, make sure you get the remote resi kits too.

[Goatman]

Have you weighed yours front and rear? I'll bet with the motor location, and the smaller V6 motor, your weight distribution is closer to 50/50. I know a built JK is heavy, but is the unsprung weight THAT heavy?

Yes, the reservoirs make a difference on the heavier vehicles. Since spring rate ramp up is determined by pressure and chamber volume, the larger chamber volume decreases the spring ramp up rate which helps when the higher pressures are used. The exponential ramp up rate of the air shock, rather than the linear rate of a coil is what makes the air shocks so sweet. Then add spring rate on both top and bottom of the piston to add remarkable stability and you have something really special. Plus the on car adjustability, and internal compression and rebound bump stops.

Let me know what lengths you're thinking. The sale from ORI is 10%, which can be a good amount on 4 shocks.

[abendx]

[quote="Goatman"]Have you weighed yours front and rear? I'll bet with the motor location, and the smaller V6 motor, your weight distribution is closer to 50/50. I know a built JK is heavy, but is the unsprung weight THAT heavy?

Yes, the reservoirs make a difference on the heavier vehicles. Since spring rate ramp up is determined by pressure and chamber volume, the larger chamber volume decreases the spring ramp up rate which helps when the higher pressures are used. The exponential ramp up rate of the air shock, rather than the linear rate of a coil is what makes the air shocks so sweet. Then add spring rate on both top and bottom of the piston to add remarkable stability and you have something really special. Plus the on car adjustability, and internal compression and rebound bump stops.

Let me know what lengths you're thinking. The sale from ORI is 10%, which can be a good amount on 4 shocks.[/quote]

Okay... how long does the sale last?

[Goatman]

Right now there is no end date. Can end anytime, but of course they just started it so it will go for awhile. The special pricing is to commemorate their 10th anniversary.

[abendx]

Okay... good. I am going to have to sit down with some better minds than mine to help figure out the length.

[Goatman]

[quote="abendx"]Okay... good. I am going to have to sit down with some better minds than mine to help figure out the length.[/quote]


I think I'd go 12" front and back. Call me if you want to talk about it.

[Crazy Sammy]

Abendx you seen mine this weekend and I have12" on the front and 14" on the back and it does pretty decent I think!

[abendx]

I gotta give you a call Richard... After seeing Josh's in action, i am impressed with the performance.

[Ben H.]

Any ideas on adding protection for the schrader valves on these. I now have them on all four corners and the rear valves are a little to close to the tires on full stuff. A rock sucked up by the tire would make for a very bad day.

[Desert Dog]

[quote="Ben H."]Any ideas on adding protection for the schrader valves on these. I now have them on all four corners and the rear valves are a little to close to the tires on full stuff. A rock sucked up by the tire would make for a very bad day.[/quote]
Running the Schrader valve on the inside of the shock is prefered, do you have the room?

Can you move your mounts farther inboard?

If none of the above, you are forced to deal with the wheels themselves. Wheel spacers? Wheels with better backspacing?

[Ben H.]

[quote="Desert Dog"][quote="Ben H."]Any ideas on adding protection for the schrader valves on these. I now have them on all four corners and the rear valves are a little to close to the tires on full stuff. A rock sucked up by the tire would make for a very bad day.[/quote]
Running the Schrader valve on the inside of the shock is prefered, do you have the room?

Can you move your mounts farther inboard?

If none of the above, you are forced to deal with the wheels themselves. Wheel spacers? Wheels with better backspacing?[/quote]

Interesting, I actually picked up 4 wheel spacers today from TrailGear. Installed one on the rear and hate it cause i loose my narrow stance and expose the rear brake calipers. Its all pretty tight, so not room to flip them around or move mounts inboard. I have an idea in the head and I'll post up once I give it a go.

[Ben H.]

Here is what I came up with for the lower valve protection on all four corners. So simple I cant believe it didnt slap me in the face.

[img]http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c65/bholt5035/20130324_191124_zps104b9a8c.jpg[/img]

Similar plan for the Upper Schrader valves, but need to get some 3.27" tube and will need to incorporate some sort of hinge as there will only be room for one suck down bolt.

[abendx]

[quote="Ben H."]Here is what I came up with for the lower valve protection on all four corners. So simple I cant believe it didnt slap me in the face.

[img]http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c65/bholt5035/20130324_191124_zps104b9a8c.jpg[/img]

Similar plan for the Upper Schrader valves, but need to get some 3.27" tube and will need to incorporate some sort of hinge as there will only be room for one suck down bolt.[/quote]

Nice.... I'm gonna steal that one!

[Ben H.]

Upper schrader guards:

[img]http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c65/bholt5035/20130326_211714_zpsa7c1aee3.jpg[/img]

[abendx]

Very nice!!

[robnoxious1]

[quote="Ben H."]Upper schrader guards:

[img]http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c65/bholt5035/20130326_211714_zpsa7c1aee3.jpg[/img][/quote]


Ben Ill bet you could get a nice little side buisiness going selling these things.

[Ben H.]

[quote="robnoxious1"][quote="Ben H."]Upper schrader guards:

[img]http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c65/bholt5035/20130326_211714_zpsa7c1aee3.jpg[/img][/quote]


Ben Ill bet you could get a nice little side buisiness going selling these things.[/quote]

Thanks, but they are not pretty enough to sell.

I've never seen something like this before, but I'm sure there are others out there that have made something like this.

If a feller had a good CNC machine, it would be killer to make some guards out of billet aluminum, with rounded edges and recessed bolts. Kind of like those bling remote reservoir clamps, but a little bigger. The schrader valve hole only needs to be about 1/2" wide. It would be killer if ORI/FOX/King, would offer some schrader valve protection.

[Ben H.]

Oh, and I have been running the ORIs in the front and Fox 2.0 coilovers in the rear and I thought that was OK. But after installing them and taking it up the mountain the other day and what a difference it makes having them on all four corners. It is a totally different rig now in every aspect...so much smoother, stable and better feeling than before. I'm SOLD on these struts. Also, handling on the road during my illegal street testing is like driving a better than stock jeep.

For Reference, with a +/-4,800 lb TJ with 12" struts and 5" up travel and 7" down travel, my pressures are:

Front: Lower 100 psi, Upper 315 psi, and I changed out the shock oil to 7w oil
Rear: Lower 90 psi, Upper 300 psi, shock oil has not been changed.

Rebound setting on all four corners is at 4. I had is set to 7, but they started to fade after going though some whoops.

I think this is dialed in for my rig/weight, after going through about 10 lbs of nitrogen and testing various pressures.

And it is perfectly OK to change the misalignment spacers and run with 1.5" mounting width, according to ORI, as long as there is not binding. I can see this being an issue for longer struts.